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Acetriad
09-23-2007, 03:36
I'm calling this thread that, because, thats what it will likely become, please, no personal insults, keep it clean.

If every household and place of business in America had guns in it, and if it was perfectly acceptable to shoot someone who was trying to rob you, or assult you or your property, what would happen?

Thought out answers please :thumbup:

Hamlet
09-23-2007, 07:03
This thread + the 'Dead penalty' thread; seems like you are busy exterminating US citizens ;)

Hoebawt
09-23-2007, 15:57
Nothing would happen its self defense

ooga booga
09-23-2007, 19:58
most crappy convienant stores (i.e. 7-11) do carry guns and do use it in self-defense at times (you see it on those crazy police video tv shows, haha). But if every business owned one I doubt there would be many burglaries and robberies. ;)

Satan666
09-23-2007, 23:45
well if you look at the history of the Wild West where no one knew who had guns and who didn't, there was less crime. Though this could have been because who wants to spend a forth of a day just to kill someone, or it could just have been because no one wanted to be in a shootout.

But in todays times i think having a gun for ... ect would just be more bad than good. I personally have a gun in my closet, but thats because that is my choice. But i don't think that i would want a gun at work.

Mahdi
09-24-2007, 00:11
haha gun in closet... yes i could be considered one of those gun toting rednecks that we are bound to hear about...

last count was well over 80 rifles and 20 pistols as well as 2 .50BMG, 1 7.62x54 which is a big gun as well and we have ammunition for every gun we own we express our right to bear arms but do we go around shooting people no... but if someone were to break into my house the would not make it out alive if someone was home and if not then i pity them since i have several large dogs one being a very nasty 130 pound lab...

if my house ever catch fire the fire department will not be called for their own safety... Teflon coated and Full Metal Jacketed rounds will pierce the bullet proof vests used by police officers

Acetriad
09-24-2007, 04:42
Do you honestly mean to tell me that if there were more guns, in places there would be LESS crime? Acording to what we have been being fed from the media and the government that is positively absurd! Guns are EVIL! All the studies and statistics that show that harsher gun control results in more crime are obviously lies propegated by the right wing, redneck, nuts who think you have to shoot anything that moves. Only by completely disarming the law abideing public do we have any chance of haveing a good society! After all, if someone is robbing you, you should give them all your money, and whatever else they want because they obviously grew up in a poor environment at home and society made them turn to a life of crime. Its YOUR fault that they have to assult you because you didn't do enough to help them. You simple heartless gun toteing rednecks just don't understand that our excellent social programs can help rehabilitate those poor unfortunate individuals who were forced by the evil capatilist system to revert to a life of crime.


Ok, I have to stop before I make myself puke. I'm only playing devils advicate here because no one is takeing the bait to post the other side. Do feel free to give some good arguments to the crap I just "helped" the other side with above.

Acetriad
09-24-2007, 04:46
Crud, here I go double posting.
You folks do realise that those stores that do carry and use weapons against crinimals are VERY subject to lawsuits. Just a month or so ago a guy shot a man who held him up in his store at gunpoint. The crinimal lived, then sued the man who shot him. AND WON.

Hamlet
09-24-2007, 04:59
[...]that our excellent social programs can help rehabilitate those poor unfortunate individuals[...]

As a member of "the European opposition", I'll just have to say, that we would never use the concept 'excellent' to describe the US' social system :P

Acetriad
09-24-2007, 05:13
As a US citicen, I would never say such a thing either... other than satirically, which I did.

Missionary
09-24-2007, 05:38
Nothing would happen its self defense

self defence isnt "he robber me so i killed him, self defence"

self defence is to a certain degree. if hes robbing you there isnt a direct threat to your life, just your harm and therefore you can defend your self by killing him. that is way to extreme.

when i was young i got into a fight, the other lad started it but yet i still got arested and charged for ABH. i was defending myself but when the other person gets a broken cheek bone and a burst blood vessel in his eye and all i got was a riped tee-shirt, (which really p****d me off) that was using excessive force, and against the law.

Hamlet
09-24-2007, 06:53
As a US citicen, I would never say such a thing either... other than satirically, which I did.

OK. That's a starting point: Now, wouldn't it be better for the US to improve the opportunities for low income groups, and thereby enabling all kids born in social distress a real opportunity to create a decent future, without being relatively disadvantaged compared to other kids? 100% free education, 100% free health care to all etc.

Then they can begin to sing: "At the end of the storm there's a golden sky, and the sweet silver song of a lack". Social and economic policy is the solution - not guns. ;)
_________________

@Missionary:

[...]the other person gets a broken cheek bone and a burst blood vessel in his eye and all i got was a riped tee-shirt, (which really p****d me off) that was using excessive force, and against the law
First name: Validated / Location: Validated / Ability to fight: Validated....You still want me to believe, that you shouldn't be called Mr. Jones? lol

ranger2112
09-24-2007, 11:53
Crud, here I go double posting.
You folks do realise that those stores that do carry and use weapons against crinimals are VERY subject to lawsuits. Just a month or so ago a guy shot a man who held him up in his store at gunpoint. The crinimal lived, then sued the man who shot him. AND WON.


thats why u dont wound...u kill. dead men tell no tales.

Warl0rd
09-24-2007, 12:16
If every household and place of business in America had guns in it, and if it was perfectly acceptable to shoot someone who was trying to rob you, or assult you or your property, what would happen?That doesn't make any sense,and if it does, that should be only in US lol

lets say i wanna kill alot of ppl :)

I leave my door unlocked, open a window and start yelling and calling for desperate help, someone is walking by the street, hears me, get in to help me out and I shoot him. I can keep doing it everyday since I won't be breaking any law:thumbup:

Or how about inviting in someone that is trying to sell me something at the door, once he gets in bang, he's dead and he won't bother me more :sneaky:

Or lets say wanna break all killing records:

Call pizza delivery, once they get inside my property for delivery, bang he's dead :sneaky:
Mail yourself something, once the delivery man gets in, bang :sneaky:

Once you have a nice pile of boddies call the police and report robber, once they get in bang! **** another robber disguised as police:o Eventually you'll have to stop killing and let them take the bodies :P
I'm sure i can find some other ways if needed :P

Hoebawt
09-24-2007, 13:38
self defence isnt "he robber me so i killed him, self defence"

self defence is to a certain degree. if hes robbing you there isnt a direct threat to your life, just your harm and therefore you can defend your self by killing him. that is way to extreme.

when i was young i got into a fight, the other lad started it but yet i still got arested and charged for ABH. i was defending myself but when the other person gets a broken cheek bone and a burst blood vessel in his eye and all i got was a riped tee-shirt, (which really p****d me off) that was using excessive force, and against the law.


No We had a incident on May 5 05 at my store where two guys came in and tried robbing us in front of us.... well my friend and I weren’t having that so we started to fight them... we almost killed one wit a fire extinguisher and we threw the other one thru a store window outside... when the cops arrived and found out wat happend they arrested the two guys.... they told us that if we ended up killin the kid we beat wit the extinguisher we woudlnt have got in trouble at all since he was robbing us on our property and it falls under self defense


Vinny self defense works on ur property and remembr u live in UK i live in america

Warl0rd
09-24-2007, 13:43
Can you prove they tried to rob you? because it could be just 2 kids that you guys decided to kick their asses for fun...

btw who paid the store window? :P

Hoebawt
09-24-2007, 14:38
The kid that went thru it and his friend... and yea if u looked inside the store it was all bloody and **** was knocked over... you can tell their was fight... plus we were the store owners and the store was closed so cops sided wit us easily

Warl0rd
09-24-2007, 15:21
A fight doesn't mean they were robbing you...

Satan666
09-24-2007, 16:54
haha gun in closet... yes i could be considered one of those gun toting rednecks that we are bound to hear about...

Its not Loaded, That is illegal. do you think i am that stupid.

ranger2112
09-24-2007, 16:58
seems "stupid" to have an unloaded gun. may as well have a bat...since an unloaded gun is just a blunt instrument

Mahdi
09-24-2007, 19:32
i have a loaded .45 ACP beside my bed and a clip laying right beside it and 5 feet from my bed i mearly have to get out of bed i have an SKS (7.62x39) with a full clip below it loaded with FMJ... and i have talked to the cops in this area if someone breaks into my house i have prefect right to shoot them but once they are down and cant move anymore i cant shoot them again unless they have a gun or some other type of weapon...


@ Acetriad Washington DC has one of the highest crime rates in all of America because you are not allowed to own a gun

WoodPecker
09-24-2007, 20:13
wow thats exactly what i would expect some ignorant dumb but american to say. look at western europe and canada

Mahdi
09-24-2007, 20:38
i hope your not talking bout me cuz i would never compare apples to oranges

Acetriad
09-25-2007, 06:03
OK. That's a starting point: Now, wouldn't it be better for the US to improve the opportunities for low income groups, and thereby enabling all kids born in social distress a real opportunity to create a decent future, without being relatively disadvantaged compared to other kids? 100% free education, 100% free health care to all etc.

Then they can begin to sing: "At the end of the storm there's a golden sky, and the sweet silver song of a lack". Social and economic policy is the solution - not guns. ;)
_________________

@Missionary:

First name: Validated / Location: Validated / Ability to fight: Validated....You still want me to believe, that you shouldn't be called Mr. Jones? lol


That is exactly what the problem is. I have no problem at all with giving someone a hand up. A hand out, I have a problem with. US education... or at least what passes for education in public schools these days is free up till senior (12th) year. Most punks and worthless types don't make it that far... although, I find it hard to blame them with the current system. And someone from a poor background can easily find a job without any help from the government... of course, the government will then attempt to cheat them out of every cent they can through taxes so they can give money to people who refuse to work. I'm not saying it's easy. It isn't. And that is why thugs and punks choose the easy path of robbing someone else who DOES do that hard work. If you were given the choice between getting shot robbing someone else's property to get by, or working for someone to get by, which would you choose?
Sure, the punks, the gangs and the lawbreakers don't need guns. We are talking about the law abiding citicens having guns.

That doesn't make any sense,and if it does, that should be only in US lol

lets say i wanna kill alot of ppl :)

I leave my door unlocked, open a window and start yelling and calling for desperate help, someone is walking by the street, hears me, get in to help me out and I shoot him. I can keep doing it everyday since I won't be breaking any law:thumbup:

Or how about inviting in someone that is trying to sell me something at the door, once he gets in bang, he's dead and he won't bother me more :sneaky:

Or lets say wanna break all killing records:

Call pizza delivery, once they get inside my property for delivery, bang he's dead :sneaky:
Mail yourself something, once the delivery man gets in, bang :sneaky:

Once you have a nice pile of boddies call the police and report robber, once they get in bang! **** another robber disguised as police:o Eventually you'll have to stop killing and let them take the bodies :P
I'm sure i can find some other ways if needed :P


Warlord, you of all people I could expect to either truely believe the tripe you just sprouted or play devil's advocate. I personally hope its the latter.
"I leave my door unlocked, open a window and start yelling and calling for desperate help" In a society that is armed, the people who come running to your help will be armed as well. If you start shooting at them, they will respond in kind... bringing more people to the scene. You have a right to defend your home, not to mass murder.

Call pizza delivery, once they get inside my property for delivery, bang he's dead :sneaky:
Mail yourself something, once the delivery man gets in, bang :sneaky:
Pretty much same as above.

Once you have a nice pile of boddies call the police and report robber, once they get in bang! **** another robber disguised as police:o Eventually you'll have to stop killing and let them take the bodies :P

What police? there would be very little need for police in this society. Why would police have to be called when the crinimal is allready dead? The only reason you need to poke holes in this theory is because either:
A:You know it would work, but you think it is to unfair to those poor crinimals
B:You are one of those people who like to take advantage of an unarmed society
or... C: you are living in a dreamworld where all crinimals; lazy ignorant pukes, rapeists, murderers, and worse can be habilitated into careing members of society by either throwing them in prison for a few years with a bunch of like-minded people so they can all compare notes, or by giving them a loving slap on the wrist and telling them not to be naughty anymore.

If I am completely off base, PLEASE further explain your argument.


i have a loaded .45 ACP beside my bed and a clip laying right beside it and 5 feet from my bed i mearly have to get out of bed i have an SKS (7.62x39) with a full clip below it loaded with FMJ... and i have talked to the cops in this area if someone breaks into my house i have prefect right to shoot them but once they are down and cant move anymore i cant shoot them again unless they have a gun or some other type of weapon...


@ Acetriad Washington DC has one of the highest crime rates in all of America because you are not allowed to own a gun


Thank you :D You have helped prove my point.... to those who will listen.


wow thats exactly what i would expect some ignorant dumb but american to say. look at western europe and canada

Ok, first off, I will not fault you for calling americans ignorant dumb buts. Because roughly 70% of the nation is. The other 30% don't know what to do about it. (and watch the language from now on it WILL be edited... thats your one warning.) And what about western europe? Read the newspaper some of the crap they throw up is true. Same with Canada. You want me to take you seriously Woody Woodpecker? Then come up with some real arguments or facts other than saying "look at china!" or some such driviel.

Warl0rd
09-25-2007, 06:41
I'm calling this thread that, because, thats what it will likely become, please, no personal insults, keep it clean.

If every household and place of business in America had guns in it, and if it was perfectly acceptable to shoot someone who was trying to rob you, or assult you or your property, what would happen?

Thought out answers please :thumbup:You never said anything about being an armed society were ppl can carry a gun in the street and there's no police! you just said what would happen if you were allowed to shoot anyone inside your property.

Missionary
09-25-2007, 07:24
Vinny self defense works on ur property and remembr u live in UK i live in america

lol, oh yeah forgot about that. land of the free, full of free people with no common sence :)

we had a guy along time ago that live on a farm (i say we i mean UK not me personally) who was constantly getting his barn and sheds on his property broken into by some local kids. after chasing them off several times he was starting to get really p****d with them. next time they came they broke into his house. so he came down the stairs with a shotgun, the kid turned to run and the farmer shot him in the back.

the farmer is currently surveing a life sentance (i think) and the kid ended up sueing him because he "claimed" to not be able to walk, and he won. (later on the newspaper "the Sun" photoed the kid riding a bike and he ended up getting prosectuted aswel :P)

Missionary
09-25-2007, 07:33
If you start shooting at them, they will respond in kind... bringing more people to the scene.

not unless he is a half decent shot, all they will be doing is staining the blood boards.


@Missionary:

First name: Validated / Location: Validated / Ability to fight: Validated....You still want me to believe, that you shouldn't be called Mr. Jones? lol

lol, took me awile to get what you meant :P - and no, i shouldnt :angry:

Acetriad
09-27-2007, 03:49
I never said anything about no police. However, an armed society who were responsible for their own actions... well, the need for police would be lessened, to say the least. It just kind of goes without thinking.