Israels war on Hamas

[Blackwater]

Israel has been waging war on Hamas in the Gaza Strip. Haven't seen any threads on it in here which I found odd so I'll start one. What do you guys think of this war? Just or unjust? Like to hear your feelings on the matter, including the protest around the world.

Such examples:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jM8bQA6FYW0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ceIb-UGssqs&feature=related

[Will]

Unjust. The only reason Hamas was firing rockets at Israel was due to the crippling blockade imposed on the Gaza strip. Hope they get a good hiding off of Hamas.

[Bram Gotink]

The Jews in Israel are using the holocaust by the Nazis to inflict their own small holocaust on the Palestines.

Whom did I quote? A British Jew (on the BBC) in a pro-Palestina demonstration

[Max Logan]

Let the Israel bomb the place and finally end this slaughter. geez!

If the Hamas was so interested in its people they would just go out and kill themselves and let the **** war be over

[Will]

Let the Israel bomb the place and finally end this slaughter. geez!

If the Hamas was so interested in its people they would just go out and kill themselves and let the **** war be over

Why not let Hamas destroy Israel and end the war that way?

[Max Logan]

Why not let Hamas destroy Israel and end the war that way?

cuz isreal is bigger and better equiped and they got more people. the least lose would be destroying Hamas.

logical choice, nothing against terrorist ;)

[Will]

cuz isreal is bigger and better equiped and they got more people. the least lose would be destroying Hamas.

logical choice, nothing against terrorist ;)

Ah, but Israel wiping out Palestinians = angers whole muslim world which declares on Israel and you have even worse problem

Hamas wiping out Israel = things calm down somewhat in middle east (unless US nukes them in retaliation:P )

[Max Logan]

Ah, but Israel wiping out Palestinians = angers whole muslim world which declares on Israel and you have even worse problem

Hamas wiping out Israel = things calm down somewhat in middle east (unless US nukes them in retaliation:P )

Muslim world can`t anger much. Esp knowing what Isreal did to them when the first 'angered' at Isreal. Also the US have bases not far from there and Turkey is not far from there. Also most of the sarrounding countries are in turmoil themselves fighting with inside corruption and unrest. I don`t thing they have the will or resources to go to lasting war with a country like Israel

[Fangz]

wow, i never thought i'd say this but...i agree with will.

[Max Logan]

wow, i never thought i'd say this but...i agree with will.

you`re obviously drunk! so your opinion doesn`t count :o

[Will]

wow, i never thought i'd say this but...i agree with will.

careful fangz, the naziness might rub off on you:P

[Xavior]

I've never understood why the UN decided to make a Jewish state. All of this **** started when the UN abused its power. More than the Jews call Jerusalem home, why shouldn't they be able to live there too?

It just doesn't work. Isreal is surrounded by Muslims on all sides. Of course there is going to be conflict. One side will fire rockets. The other side will bomb them in retaliation. More rockets will be fired in retaliation of the bombs, it won't end.

If only the US wasn't so ****ed pro-Isreal...

[Fangz]

agreed

[Xavior]

Actually, I have a great idiea to solve the situation. We'll hold a fantasy draft, kind of like a hockey draft.

Countries which are usually pro-Isreal will draft Isreali families and they will immigrate to these countries. It will be snake, so something like 1-30, then 30-1 again. Families will list their occupations so the poorer GDP countries will be able to draft the more skilled families. This draft will continue until only the homeless, drug dealers, criminals, and hobos are left. Since no one will want them, we'll ship them to Australia.

Now the Palestinians will have their homeland back, the Muslims are happy, and all of us will be poorer! I should be appointed to the UN.

[Will]

I've never understood why the UN decided to make a Jewish state. All of this **** started when the UN abused its power. More than the Jews call Jerusalem home, why shouldn't they be able to live there too?

It just doesn't work. Isreal is surrounded by Muslims on all sides. Of course there is going to be conflict. One side will fire rockets. The other side will bomb them in retaliation. More rockets will be fired in retaliation of the bombs, it won't end.

If only the US wasn't so ****ed pro-Isreal...

The real roots of this go back to the first world war and something called the Balfour Declaration and the Sykes-Picot agreement. The Balfour Declaration was a statement by a British Minister, Arthur Balfour, that after the war ended a jewish homeland would be created in what was then Palestine, under turkish control. After the Ottoman Empire was carved up, Britain and France took control of the former turkish colonies (Palestine going to Britain) who then began to allow large scale Jewish Immigration. After a number of problems with arab revolts, we then get WW2 and the crippling of British power. After WW2, Britain fought jewish terrorist groups (Irgun, Stern gang) for control of Palestine. Since it was in serious financial trouble, it was decided that it simply wasn't worth the trouble dealing with the jewish terrorists and the British pulled out, giving control to the UN. After Partition, we then get the so called "War of Independence" where "little Israel" fights off the Arab hordes. The reality was that the sides were far more evenly matched even then, and Israel took control of way more than it was supposed to have.

Cue 60 years of instability in the region.

[Max Logan]

The arabs should`ve just sat back and enjoyed the new view. Now they made even more of a mess for themselves. way to go!

[kingmyth]

Hamas is listed as a terrorist organization by Canada, the European Union,Israel, Japan, and the United States, and is banned in Jordan. Australia and the United Kingdom list only the military wing of Hamas, the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, as a terrorist organization. The United States and the European Union have both implemented restrictive measures against Hamas on an international level.

Guess who funds HAMAS? It's Israel's friendliest zionist-hating arab republic neighbor, Iran. If another county was funding a political party and an insurgency in your country i would want to kill them but since attacking Iran directly could prompt a nuclear exchange or ignite the middle east against Israel, so Israel is forced to fight proxy wars in the Gaza Strip and the West Bank, and the recent war with Hezbollah in Lebanon.

[Will]

The Gaza strip is no longer part of Israel, so even if Iran is funding Hamas it isn't an insurgency.

[kingmyth]

Good point, but the fact is a government controlled by a terrorist organization is attacking Israel on a regular basis from the Gaza strip and they immediately attacked Israel after the cease fire was over and started this whole conflict, if they were truly representing the people they would have tried to talk with Israel not bombard them.

[Will]

Good point, but the fact is a government controlled by a terrorist organization is attacking Israel on a regular basis from the Gaza strip and they immediately attacked Israel after the cease fire was over and started this whole conflict, if they were truly representing the people they would have tried to talk with Israel not bombard them.

Perhaps if everyone stopped calling them terrorists they'd be more willing to negotiate? That and Israel has been blockading the Gaza strip for months.

[kingmyth]

terrorist

noun
a radical who employs terror as a political weapon; usually organizes with other terrorists in small cells; often uses religion as a cover for terrorist activities

Yes, HAMAS is doesn't fit the terrorist definition perfectly but that being said ,why do they attack civilian targets? Would it to "terrorize" the Israeli people?, that to me is the definition of terrorist. If they strictly went after military targets i would call this a war for independence and maybe they would even get help but the fact is if they didn't kill civilians the world would overlook them. If you think about it, the terrorist organization thrives on killing civilians, look at Iraq, the American press has reported and tallied the dead American soldiers, around 4200, its like a score sheet for the terrorists and if you compare that number to the number of civilian dead, its around 90,000. You could get the picture that terrorist organizations target civilians and that is what HAMAS is doing.

On another note do you remember when HAMAS took power in the Gaza strip? They were fighting the FATAH government and they just took over after they won the elections and the majority in their parliament, they killed their own people in mass because they didn't want a terrorist organization and tried to fight them.

[Will]

Hamas uses the tactics it does because there is no way in hell it can take the IDF head on. It is AKs and a few RPGs versus tanks, helicopters and jets. Arguably they target civilians but the IDF doesn't give a **** about killing them either. It will happily shell a complex and kill 100 palestinians in order to kill 1 Hamas leader.

[SoB]

Hmm, let me get an view point in here,

What would say to being stuck in the most crowded place in the world and which is also exceptionally small and add to that there are barriers and walls all around you with an overlord dictating how much food, general supplies, etc you, your family, friends and nieghbours get.
You are stripped of your dignity, you are restricted in your movements, your family is starving, you have no money, even if you managed to get some money there is nothing left to buy.
To top that off every once in a while the overlords who are constantly patrolling the borders will push the border lines your way as they need more space and make a wall to prevent you from getting to where you once did.

This sounds a lot like prison doesn't it (maybe even a holocaust), take this, you were born into this, you did no harm or crime to deserve this. Would you try and break free from this, would you rebel against the oppressive and powerful overlord in an attempt to have a better life?

[Fangz]

on top of that, the whole world thinks you are evil

[Fangz]

The real roots of this go back to the first world war and something called the Balfour Declaration and the Sykes-Picot agreement. The Balfour Declaration was a statement by a British Minister, Arthur Balfour, that after the war ended a jewish homeland would be created in what was then Palestine, under turkish control. After the Ottoman Empire was carved up, Britain and France took control of the former turkish colonies (Palestine going to Britain) who then began to allow large scale Jewish Immigration. After a number of problems with arab revolts, we then get WW2 and the crippling of British power. After WW2, Britain fought jewish terrorist groups (Irgun, Stern gang) for control of Palestine. Since it was in serious financial trouble, it was decided that it simply wasn't worth the trouble dealing with the jewish terrorists and the British pulled out, giving control to the UN. After Partition, we then get the so called "War of Independence" where "little Israel" fights off the Arab hordes. The reality was that the sides were far more evenly matched even then, and Israel took control of way more than it was supposed to have.

Cue 60 years of instability in the region.

What's a Balfour? lol

[Fangz]

terrorist

noun
a radical who employs terror as a political weapon; usually organizes with other terrorists in small cells; often uses religion as a cover for terrorist activities

nice, a definition that only uses the word it is defining twice. that sets it straight alright.

[SoB]

Here's a thought, which hair brained idiot decided look, the jews in germany are being killed in horrible ways, you know what, we won the war, we have germany, lets stick them in the middle of the middle east where there is centuries of religious tension after several crusades and other horrific events.

Bottom line, they were jewish, yes but they were still of german and european nationality, why not make a part of germany a a home land for the jews, instead of imposing on that troubled area in the middle east slowly pushing out the people that are living there, causing chaos.

In fact, come to think about it, why couldn't all the people that were freed from the hands of the germans just simply go back to there old homes in europe and live in there own society.

[Will]

Here's a thought, which hair brained idiot decided look, the jews in germany are being killed in horrible ways, you know what, we won the war, we have germany, lets stick them in the middle of the middle east where there is centuries of religious tension after several crusades and other horrific events.

Bottom line, they were jewish, yes but they were still of german and european nationality, why not make a part of germany a a home land for the jews, instead of imposing on that troubled area in the middle east slowly pushing out the people that are living there, causing chaos.

In fact, come to think about it, why couldn't all the people that were freed from the hands of the germans just simply go back to there old homes in europe and live in there own society.

well, the "homeland for the jews" thing was going on before WW2.

[kingmyth]

Here's a thought, which hair brained idiot decided look, the jews in germany are being killed in horrible ways, you know what, we won the war, we have germany, lets stick them in the middle of the middle east where there is centuries of religious tension after several crusades and other horrific events.

Bottom line, they were jewish, yes but they were still of german and european nationality, why not make a part of germany a a home land for the jews, instead of imposing on that troubled area in the middle east slowly pushing out the people that are living there, causing chaos.

In fact, come to think about it, why couldn't all the people that were freed from the hands of the germans just simply go back to there old homes in europe and live in there own society.

Well adding to what will said the homeland of the Jewish people was that area well before the Islam was founded so if its a matter of who was there first they would win. That being said i would be pissed and fight back if my land was taken just so that other people could live on it........oh wait i live in America where they can do that by calling it Imminent Domain.

Also, yes they put them in the middle east but back when they relocated them, the british controlled most of the middle east and the french controlled Egypt so it was going well until the British and French pulled out and that's when the religious minded people started to control the middle east.


Hmm, let me get an view point in here,

What would say to being stuck in the most crowded place in the world and which is also exceptionally small and add to that there are barriers and walls all around you with an overlord dictating how much food, general supplies, etc you, your family, friends and nieghbours get.
You are stripped of your dignity, you are restricted in your movements, your family is starving, you have no money, even if you managed to get some money there is nothing left to buy.
To top that off every once in a while the overlords who are constantly patrolling the borders will push the border lines your way as they need more space and make a wall to prevent you from getting to where you once did.

This sounds a lot like prison doesn't it (maybe even a holocaust), take this, you were born into this, you did no harm or crime to deserve this. Would you try and break free from this, would you rebel against the oppressive and powerful overlord in an attempt to have a better life?

You make it sound like some type of prison camp, and to some it is, but they don't have to live there, they can immigrate to other arab countries but they don't. Although a lot of this can be blamed on Israel the same can be said of the Palestinians. Immediately after the last cease fire they began launching rockets, that to me shows that Palestinian government led by HAMAS isn't wiling to come to terms with Israel. Also you can't blame the Israeli government for putting up walls and barriers to the Gaza strip because that where all the problems come from for them.

[Will]

Well adding to what will said the homeland of the Jewish people was that area well before the Islam was founded so if its a matter of who was there first they would win. That being said i would be pissed and fight back if my land was taken just so that other people could live on it........oh wait i live in America where they can do that by calling it Imminent Domain.

Also, yes they put them in the middle east but back when they relocated them, the british controlled most of the middle east and the french controlled Egypt so it was going well until the British and French pulled out and that's when the religious minded people started to control the middle east.


.

Erm, the British controlled egypt not the french. Broadly speaking, Egypt, Palestine, Jordan, Iraq and Iran were controlled by Britain, while Syria and Lebanon were controlled by France.

[Will]

http://www.annainthemiddleeast.com/albums/maps_media/lg_044x.jpg

Sums up the root of Palestinian and Hamas anger.

[SoB]

A picture says a thousands words

[Kamran]

i would like to know what will happen once USA is no longer a power house?

[Raul]

This is so stupid, Jews land and stuff, why dont the UN start making Aztec lands, Incan Lands, Cro MAgnon land and all those ethinc racez empires that lost their old lands, god we can rename the european union, Roman empire this is all stupid, that zone of the world is for muslims and thats it, Jews that came in 1945 should return to europe the **** with this

[Will]

Raul there are a fair number of Arab christians.

[Raul]

i would like to know what will happen once USA is no longer a power house?

Mexico takes control of all southern US in a massive mexican rise all over the southern states. Some days later we invade the rest of the Union, and we invite all Europeans, Africans, Asians, to overthrow the rest of the americans.

then Latino border will go up too Canada Border. Canada is safe, i like canada =)

[Raul]

Raul there are a fair number of Arab christians.

yeah thats right

i said wrong by naming "muslim land", its for middle east people =)

if christian arabs want to fight muslim arabs
they have all the right to do so

jews were taken thousands of years ago from there, why return them now

God!, its like us mexicans starting a revolution in south US to recover texas and california, and we lost it less thatn 200 years ago :P

why wont we? cause we already controlled it again, but we use US economy for our favor and return money back to mexico =)

[Divine Intervention]

lol the minute the mexican army crosses the US border in its "invasion" they will all disband, attempt to get green cards, look for some illegal immigrant jobs and will just generally leech off the USA. although im sure that this is actually the real plan with which Mexico plans to destroy USA :P

jks ;)

[Will]

yeah thats right

i said wrong by naming "muslim land", its for middle east people =)

if christian arabs want to fight muslim arabs
they have all the right to do so

jews were taken thousands of years ago from there, why return them now

God!, its like us mexicans starting a revolution in south US to recover texas and california, and we lost it less thatn 200 years ago :P

why wont we? cause we already controlled it again, but we use US economy for our favor and return money back to mexico =)

Palestine and Mexico aren't remotely comparable.

[Hoebawt]

RAUL LOL u had me rollign readign those post.... i was thinking hte same exact thing Anton was... hahaha thats so great

[Max Logan]

RAUL LOL u had me rollign readign those post.... i was thinking hte same exact thing Anton was... hahaha thats so great

been trying? :p

[Hoebawt]

that one is over my head max

[Spetsnaz]

From what i heard, Maybe there's going to be a Genocide, It's pretty obvious they are close to each other and they built walls to keep em out, They can't get food water or anything. The "Jews" think of them as rats with disease keeping them out, As if it was relating to Hitlers problems. I mean a Palestinian 3 Month old baby killed while his mother was sleeping next to him, Families home being demolished. Jews think they are free just because Hitlers gone, That doesn't mean there isn't justice. **** Jews, I don't know if they know what they're doing is right but i smell Genocide. It's just the beginning but when it happens the Internal Court of Justice will have enough evidence less than 1-2 Months. I know that Palestinians have done bad things to Israel like bombings at clubs and populated places, but right now Palestinians aren't doing anything but saving other peoples lives, The way that the Jews did it was more devastating. Bombs will probably come constantly but innocent lives are taken, They think that all Palestinians are ****ing load of **** due to their Homeland Security issues but bombing civillians places too?
So actually they think that bombing there will just eliminate more terrorist.
Honestly, I'm siding with the Palestinians, Trap like rats less food or water to grab.
Hitler -----> Jews
Jews -----> Palestinians

[Kamran]

well the jews should know the arabs will respond with blood aswell when there turns comes.

[Spetsnaz]

Idk, Don't they have to follow the Ten Commandments since they're jews?