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Calvin74
06-07-2011, 21:32
Right now CR contains 73% of all farms in the game. As the set goes on we will only raise that number and quite possible get over 80%. This is going to kill the food market with those top indies. There will hardly be any food on there even when we are selling food.

It is still early enough in the set that another tag might want to consider running farmer as well as their current strats.


Just word to the wise:)

CommunistCapitalism
06-08-2011, 04:37
i thought this fair warning might have had something to do with the fact that every state is an inf ***** and 98% of the global military is composed of infantry and i personally make up 25% of the games ships. pretty sad that all sky does is spam infantry, maybe the fair warning should go out to their states who could easily be AAed all the way down to ground zero. Just saying :thumbup:

Soviet Russia
06-08-2011, 04:52
If they are defenceless and no one dares to hit them, it seems Sky is having the best unit strategy.

I would not blame them if I were you.

Salabanzi
06-08-2011, 06:23
i thought this fair warning might have had something to do with the fact that every state is an inf ***** and 98% of the global military is composed of infantry and i personally make up 25% of the games ships. pretty sad that all sky does is spam infantry, maybe the fair warning should go out to their states who could easily be AAed all the way down to ground zero. Just saying :thumbup:

I personally hate full inf and want to produce ships, sams, jets etc. But top states that are not Sky are also inf hoarding so I if I want to SA them I have to also inf hoard.If u want warn someone then warn all states not only sky states :D

And thanks for the information Calvin, I start collecting some food then :)

KelpKris
06-08-2011, 10:09
i thought this fair warning might have had something to do with the fact that every state is an inf ***** and 98% of the global military is composed of infantry and i personally make up 25% of the games ships. pretty sad that all sky does is spam infantry, maybe the fair warning should go out to their states who could easily be AAed all the way down to ground zero. Just saying :thumbup:

I think it's BeeNo who has always said that you shouldn't look at the number of units but their military strengths, because for example even in the very end of the set about 50-75% of the units are infantry, but their total strength is only about 10-25%.

If we are talking about current situation, then there are a few thoughts on my mind. Indeed, right now infantry consists about 85-90% of total military strength. However this also means that most of the states are "inf hoarding" not only us and for that matter if there are no wars this is what most of the states do for the most of the set (considering the number of ships skyrockets only in the last few days). If we take for example last set then LoR's top went well over 200m inf with little/no defense, but I can understand that. I like to think about it as adopting to the current situation because upgrading too early can hamper your state and take away your chances to get the top spot. Also I find it somewhat pointless and it's probably more of a psychological thing if your opponents see that you have for example 1m lvl8 ships. Because on larger scale if someone wants that attack you that 1m ship makes little difference. It starts to change somewhere in mid-set or last third of the set, when your (top) state is strong enough so that there might not be any states that could break you even if they convert 100% to 1 unit type. Combine this with a few sleepless nights and some luck and you will keep your extremely balanced top state alive till the end of the set.

Basically I don't care about how other people are playing and I find that it's not up to me to say that they should play this way or that way.

Max Logan
06-08-2011, 11:35
i don`t get it, who cares what units they hoard? what`s the **** difference? you`re just pissed cuz they`re ahead of you. grow some manhood and buzz off. if my one man tag can keep up, you should be able too. and I`m not even doing anything besides cashing and storing my bank. so if you have NA support you should be able to take them on, if you don`t, well, kudos to you, you suck *** and should not be netting anyway, cuz even if Sky played with no tech you`d still lose. so stfu and just play the game :thumbup:

Soviet Russia
06-08-2011, 12:09
i don`t get it, who cares what units they hoard? what`s the **** difference? you`re just pissed cuz they`re ahead of you. grow some manhood and buzz off. if my one man tag can keep up, you should be able too. and I`m not even doing anything besides cashing and storing my bank. so if you have NA support you should be able to take them on, if you don`t, well, kudos to you, you suck *** and should not be netting anyway, cuz even if Sky played with no tech you`d still lose. so stfu and just play the game :thumbup:

calm down:cool:

CommunistCapitalism
06-08-2011, 13:22
I personally hate full inf and want to produce ships, sams, jets etc. But top states that are not Sky are also inf hoarding so I if I want to SA them I have to also inf hoard.If u want warn someone then warn all states not only sky states :D

And thanks for the information Calvin, I start collecting some food then :)

i would warn all nations but when i'm warning the top 10, its basically just Sky + a handful of LoR and random states. Well played boys. :thumbup:


i don`t get it, who cares what units they hoard? what`s the **** difference? you`re just pissed cuz they`re ahead of you. grow some manhood and buzz off. if my one man tag can keep up, you should be able too. and I`m not even doing anything besides cashing and storing my bank. so if you have NA support you should be able to take them on, if you don`t, well, kudos to you, you suck *** and should not be netting anyway, cuz even if Sky played with no tech you`d still lose. so stfu and just play the game :thumbup:

wow the hostillity! If i was seriously netting i would not have joined a half casher half indy high tax nation. If i was netting i wouldn't have already upgraded ships sams and spies. I'm not jealous, i don't expect to top these guys, moradon and a lot of sky are good players, i'm just saying that in old times they would be prime targets for suiciders.

Calvin74
06-08-2011, 14:05
i would warn all nations but when i'm warning the top 10, its basically just Sky + a handful of LoR and random states. Well played boys. :thumbup:



wow the hostillity! If i was seriously netting i would not have joined a half casher half indy high tax nation. If i was netting i wouldn't have already upgraded ships sams and spies. I'm not jealous, i don't expect to top these guys, moradon and a lot of sky are good players, i'm just saying that in old times they would be prime targets for suiciders.

i like to think the game has actually gotten better where people can play how they want and not have to worry about a suicide...

Max Logan
06-08-2011, 14:58
i would warn all nations but when i'm warning the top 10, its basically just Sky + a handful of LoR and random states. Well played boys. :thumbup:



wow the hostillity! If i was seriously netting i would not have joined a half casher half indy high tax nation. If i was netting i wouldn't have already upgraded ships sams and spies. I'm not jealous, i don't expect to top these guys, moradon and a lot of sky are good players, i'm just saying that in old times they would be prime targets for suiciders.

what old times? the ones where suiciders drove away all the good netters and people who actually enjoyed the game? great times, great times...

p.s. as I said before, you have no clue, what 'old times' are, so don`t get me started again

CommunistCapitalism
06-08-2011, 15:32
what old times? the ones where suiciders drove away all the good netters and people who actually enjoyed the game? great times, great times...

p.s. as I said before, you have no clue, what 'old times' are, so don`t get me started again

i guess i keep catching you on your time of the month, i'm sorry max i'll try to be more considerate and mark it on my calendar before i post on forums again

Max Logan
06-08-2011, 17:46
Man, sorry, mine (mixing up languages) manhood is experiencing some serious leaking out this time of month, so yeah, you should reconsider minding your own instrument of glory, or shame, I can`t be certain, it`s a size thing. but don`t worry, you know the saying, it`s not the size that matters.

is it me, or the 'your mom', 'period', 'anything balls related' jokes are getting dumber and dumber? mine excluded.

vussu
06-08-2011, 18:44
and now when a sky member is in top1, a dork comes out and starts talking about how we inf *****...where were you last round?

CommunistCapitalism
06-08-2011, 18:50
is it me, or the 'your mom', 'period', 'anything balls related' jokes are getting dumber and dumber? mine excluded.

i think you're just getting dumber <3

Max Logan
06-09-2011, 03:24
i think you're just getting dumber <3

and I`m still leagues ahead of your puny mind >3

BeeNo
06-09-2011, 03:29
and now when a sky member is in top1, a dork comes out and starts talking about how we inf *****...where were you last round?

weren't you talking about infantry hording last round?

by the way i really like your signature!! "Fun fact: You get 15% bonus in military production when you list your nationality as Estonian." :thumbup:

anyways i think kris has it right.

the truth is a top state upgrades as quickly as possible, and months where the top states don't upgrade until later in the month are simply months where there is more competition for the top spot and no-one can gain separation.

Ragnar
06-09-2011, 05:10
I start collecting some food then

*EVERY ONE* should be doing that *NOW*!!!! When our banks are maxed out, we're not going to screw ourselves just so you guys can get food to eat while you attack us and make us lose billions in cash!!!

Oh, and our banks are filling up fast!! You know you got a lot of money in the bank when taking it out triples your NW!!! :D

*Is still waiting to see that 50 billion bank cap get removed...for a daily 1% fee, or the option to buy and use science to upgrade the bank cap!!!* Once that happens, *then* we'll feed you guys longer!!!

Max Logan
06-09-2011, 05:39
I`ll just ask Calvin nicely to sell something... :laugh:

vussu
06-09-2011, 12:55
weren't you talking about infantry hording last round?



i was talking about the same thing that when sky is in top, then there are always whiners

Salabanzi
06-09-2011, 18:09
I`ll just ask Calvin nicely to sell something... :laugh:
Ask for me too :rolleyes:

Calvin74
06-09-2011, 18:22
lol
if yall are lucky we will just jump over you and netgain:P

BeeNo
06-09-2011, 19:45
so this message was to give us enough time to organize an boycott?

i take it back, please please please just jump me and net gain :)

Calvin74
06-09-2011, 20:38
so this message was to give us enough time to organize an boycott?

i take it back, please please please just jump me and net gain :)

you can try to organize a boycott if you want however i think i would be able to work out a deal with sky:P

you don't want to lose 20% of your tnw finish just to prove a point to me do you?

this is solely a warning and more than i thought i needed to give.
clearly no one is listening since CR now accounts for 70% of the farms in the game....

Ragnar
06-10-2011, 05:46
I start collecting some food then

Any one that hasn't joined Salabanzi in working on bombing himself with enough food to last until almost the end of the round is a total n00bie. It won't be long before the game starts forcing us to starve you all, as in like a few days to a week. Case in point: When my current food on the market sells, I'll be just 10 billion away from leaving the market until the round is about to end. Don't take it personally! Blame the horrible bank setting!!!! http://forums.nation-wars.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Soviet Russia
06-10-2011, 06:29
I approve the bank settings. It makes stocking harder. I personally am a mid-level stocker for some sets, however that's because I do not have much time to be an indy and war ;) It'd be terrible if the nation-wars turns into nation-nets or nation-stocks :P

Max Logan
06-10-2011, 13:22
Any one that hasn't joined Salabanzi in working on bombing himself with enough food to last until almost the end of the round is a total n00bie. It won't be long before the game starts forcing us to starve you all, as in like a few days to a week. Case in point: When my current food on the market sells, I'll be just 10 billion away from leaving the market until the round is about to end. Don't take it personally! Blame the horrible bank setting!!!! http://forums.nation-wars.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

so...70% of the farmers are gonna put their food on sell at the last few days? that`s 2-3b each... You seriously think it`s gonna sell? 12b food+others?

Calvin74
06-10-2011, 14:08
so...70% of the farmers are gonna put their food on sell at the last few days? that`s 2-3b each... You seriously think it`s gonna sell? 12b food+others?

actually if done right yes it will sell.... every bit of it:P

BeeNo
06-10-2011, 16:22
It won't be long before the game starts forcing us to starve you all, as in like a few days to a week. Case in point: When my current food on the market sells, I'll be just 10 billion away from leaving the market until the round is about to end. Don't take it personally! Blame the horrible bank setting!!!

this is not the bank setting, this is your choice to play this way.

trying to blackmail us into supporting calvins push for an increased bank max is not wise. although creative, there are many ways to handle this situation without changing the game.

Max Logan
06-10-2011, 16:27
actually if done right yes it will sell.... every bit of it:P

well, knowing you, you`re gonna start selling 3 days left in set, so yours will sell, yes :p

Ragnar
06-10-2011, 18:26
trying to blackmail us

It's not blackmail, it's called us using our brains, and playing the right way. Give us one reason why we should be stupid when our banks are full and keep selling food just so you guys can also destroy billions in cash as you attack us for our land (You lose 3% of your out of bank cash per attack.), and we also end up with high per turn expenses if we bought Military to keep from losing the cash. I'll pass on playing the game the stupid way and go with the smart way...starving you guys until the end!!!! http://forums.nation-wars.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Now, be smart and stock up on food while we're giving you the chance to get it, while supplies last!!

Calvin74
06-10-2011, 18:32
well, knowing you, you`re gonna start selling 3 days left in set, so yours will sell, yes :p

yeah i do like the early jump:P

CommunistCapitalism
06-10-2011, 20:21
It's not blackmail, it's called us using our brains, and playing the right way. Give us one reason why we should be stupid when our banks are full and keep selling food just so you guys can also destroy billions in cash as you attack us for our land (You lose 3% of your out of bank cash per attack.), and we also end up with high per turn expenses if we bought Military to keep from losing the cash. I'll pass on playing the game the stupid way and go with the smart way...starving you guys until the end!!!! http://forums.nation-wars.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Now, be smart and stock up on food while we're giving you the chance to get it, while supplies last!!

haha this is a funny post. You're using your brains, but only partly. If you stop selling food, the indy's have less units to sell. That means you can't jump as high. Suit yourself but i think the joke will be on you with 50bill in the bank that will have to be spent on the black market. Enjoy your strategy though :thumbup:

kitoy
06-10-2011, 20:35
*declares on CR*

Calvin74
06-10-2011, 20:35
haha this is a funny post. You're using your brains, but only partly. If you stop selling food, the indy's have less units to sell. That means you can't jump as high. Suit yourself but i think the joke will be on you with 50bill in the bank that will have to be spent on the black market. Enjoy your strategy though :thumbup:

i have done the math and even buying off the black market the end result is vastly better...

Calvin74
06-10-2011, 20:36
this is not the bank setting, this is your choice to play this way.

trying to blackmail us into supporting calvins push for an increased bank max is not wise. although creative, there are many ways to handle this situation without changing the game.

beeno not once in this thread have i said anything about a bigger bank
infact i don't even think i am the one that starts those discussions
however you are always the 1st one to come out against a bigger bank. why?

Calvin74
06-10-2011, 20:37
*declares on CR*

lol
that is fine if you want to however you would be destroying end finishes for a lot of people:P

Nat22
06-10-2011, 21:23
however you are always the 1st one to come out against a bigger bank. why?

bank envy?

or maybe i'm getting bank confused with some other word... Dance::

BeeNo
06-10-2011, 21:37
while i'm not entirely opposed to it a larger bank, i'm annoyed at comments suggesting "give us a bigger bank, or starve".

some players do have a hard timing playing up top, racking up large military losses and higher expenses for little gain. however, i know that i can finish higher by jumping, even without a nation army.

your delayed jumping strategy is an interesting new approach to stocking, but it certainly isn't the only "smart" way to play a farmer state.

as i mentioned above i'm not entirely against changing the bank size, or adding a technology that lets you stock past 50bil. but what will that accomplish in relation to this argument? say we bump it to 75bil? farmers still stock well over that amount, this would not solve our complaints. there is something i don't like about altering things in this game to improve certain nations chosen strategy.

hibbidy hubbidy!!!

kitoy
06-10-2011, 21:42
lol
that is fine if you want to however you would be destroying end finishes for a lot of people:P

no worries.. after wiping CR, half of LoR will be farmers then everyone is happy.. :P

KelpKris
06-10-2011, 23:05
It's not blackmail, it's called us using our brains, and playing the right way. Give us one reason why we should be stupid when our banks are full and keep selling food just so you guys can also destroy billions in cash as you attack us for our land (You lose 3% of your out of bank cash per attack.), and we also end up with high per turn expenses if we bought Military to keep from losing the cash. I'll pass on playing the game the stupid way and go with the smart way...starving you guys until the end!!!! http://forums.nation-wars.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Now, be smart and stock up on food while we're giving you the chance to get it, while supplies last!!

I think you guys just start to circulate the food (read: buy back your own food from the market) from time to time, or at least this would save you some cash when done correctly.

Right now the problem lies in the number of players, there aren't enough farmers (most of the sets) for decent stocking. Food price hits 100 too soon. This creates this awkward situation where farmers themselves buy off all the available food.

It made me wonder how much food/cash does a farmer lose then? So I looked at the losses of a top farmer (in both cases it was Salabanzi):
Jan 2011 SaLaBaNz1(#57) [CR] 40.916 $371.814.680
May 2011 SaLaBaNz1(#63) [CR] 28.189 $244.536.451

Now I'm not going to lay down you the numbers just yet, because I'm interested to know how much food/cash do you people think he lost in those 2 sets? To make the guessing a bit easier I can tell that he most likely was somewhat more active in January set, because the cash/food combined had about the same value what he lost in May set. Most of the losses in January set came from cash and in May set from food.

This bank size talk reminds me Domination, where we had only 20G bank! There were 2 ways to compensate this: different land grab formula that made easier for stockers to keep their land + taking goods back from market was free, but you couldn't do it before 24h.

Basically I don't mind making changes in bank size limit, because it's probably the easiest solution if you want to give a score boost to stocking farmers, but there are others who can benefit from it as well, like top state who has say 450-500G on hand (you can also guess where did I come up with this number). Combine increased bank limit with premium account (money from sold goods ends up directly in bank) and in the end of the set you should be able to see the results. However BeeNo has a good point - are (stocking) farmers underpowered compared to others and do they need boost? In the end I think it comes down to how much time does one have to invest (on average) in order to get a certain score.

Lastly, I believe you actually can save some money if you would keep your extra cash in army (that is, if there is anything to buy), especially when your nations tax is 0%.

Calvin74
06-10-2011, 23:26
I think you guys just start to circulate the food (read: buy back your own food from the market) from time to time, or at least this would save you some cash when done correctly.

Right now the problem lies in the number of players, there aren't enough farmers (most of the sets) for decent stocking. Food price hits 100 too soon. This creates this awkward situation where farmers themselves buy off all the available food.

It made me wonder how much food/cash does a farmer lose then? So I looked at the losses of a top farmer (in both cases it was Salabanzi):
Jan 2011 SaLaBaNz1(#57) [CR] 40.916 $371.814.680
May 2011 SaLaBaNz1(#63) [CR] 28.189 $244.536.451

Now I'm not going to lay down you the numbers just yet, because I'm interested to know how much food/cash do you people think he lost in those 2 sets? To make the guessing a bit easier I can tell that he most likely was somewhat more active in January set, because the cash/food combined had about the same value what he lost in May set. Most of the losses in January set came from cash and in May set from food.

This bank size talk reminds me Domination, where we had only 20G bank! There were 2 ways to compensate this: different land grab formula that made easier for stockers to keep their land + taking goods back from market was free, but you couldn't do it before 24h.

Basically I don't mind making changes in bank size limit, because it's probably the easiest solution if you want to give a score boost to stocking farmers, but there are others who can benefit from it as well, like top state who has say 450-500G on hand (you can also guess where did I come up with this number). Combine increased bank limit with premium account (money from sold goods ends up directly in bank) and in the end of the set you should be able to see the results. However BeeNo has a good point - are (stocking) farmers underpowered compared to others and do they need boost? In the end I think it comes down to how much time does one have to invest (on average) in order to get a certain score.

Lastly, I believe you actually can save some money if you would keep your extra cash in army (that is, if there is anything to buy), especially when your nations tax is 0%.

i am not saying that the bank needs to be raised and think it would be better with a different lg formula AND if the cash lost wasn't so high or capped out per hit...

also sal got a bit of help those sets and having tested the limits myself i am confident to say that in the current game scenario without help a stocking farmer will not break 300m. that is the upper limit of that strat. the upside is that if played correctly the low end of the scale starts around 150m nw and moves up quickly...

keeping the extra cash in military is one way to do it however that can quickly screw a country over if the military doesn't sell and you either can't play turns or you play turns with a significantly higher loss due to upkeep.

i think farmer is strong enough however i think indy is overpowered and casher/techer are too weak to compete. techer is just worthless right now given that by day 3-4 they are at a 60% or more disadvantage.

comparing a farmer stocker to a casher stocker is doable but 9 times out of 10 a casher stocker will not even come close in the end to a farmer. they just can't maintain the land alright i am 3k acres ahead of devil and he plays pretty decent (although he has made fewer grabs than i have he has lost less in grabs as well) and he would have to cash 100% of his turns to get the same production i get. if this were to happen the land differential would only increase putting him at even more of a disadvantage. i wont go into his stock details however i am confident to say he has the most stocked of any casher however his stock is a pretty far cry from what the top farmers have stocked at this point right now.

and this is less than half way into the set.

however i didn't start this thread to turn into a farmer vs the world thread.
you guys may not like our tactics and i know there will be complaining later in the set and i was hoping to get a big tag to start the farmer support to help the market. yes we will keep hundreds of millions of food on hand and you guys can debate if there is a smarter way to do it. however over the last few years i have tested every single method of this strat and know that this is what brings the highest end game finish


and to reiterate stocker isn't underpowered. certain strats MIGHT be but as a whole farmer isn't weak. what pisses of most stockers and prevents this from being a viable strat is the landgrab formula and the cash loss forumla vs the food loss forumla.

also the fact that cash brings in NW and food doesn't so holding cash hurts us even more:P

Ragnar
06-17-2011, 01:21
So, how many of you guys listened to King David's warning on the seven year famine and stocked up on food??? http://forums.nation-wars.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Calvin74
06-17-2011, 02:08
So, how many of you guys listened to King David's warning on the seven year famine and stocked up on food??? http://forums.nation-wars.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

according to recent chat boxes not enough correctly used the time of feast to prepare for the time of famine

but don't worry people in just a number of days there will be feast again!
i will post a few days out from when we are selling food to let people know do they can save turns in order to maximize their returns:)

Ragnar
06-27-2011, 04:31
lol that strat only works cause your nation is the only farming nation. It won't work next set. You'll be forced to sell during the set or sit on your food at the end.

Any one wanna guess what the change is??? er we already do sell during the set. We just choose to sell during the last five days of the set!!!!

Nat22
06-27-2011, 10:21
Any one wanna guess what the change is??? er we already do sell during the set. We just choose to sell during the last five days of the set!!!!

You're not allowed more than 200 mill food on hand at any given time... HA!

Clowntown
06-27-2011, 11:16
OMG lol FOOD BANKS!

Now what u gonna do.. 150 mill cap on food stored :P put that on everon enot just farmers.. that should make things interesting :D

BeeNo
06-27-2011, 14:56
granary's?