View Full Version : Just a couple of thoughts
There are two very opposed thoughts and perspectives in the game:
There are those that think that it is perfectly reasonable to only use one troop type in the game and expect all others to respect this and only attack their strong suit.
There are those that feel that it is unreasonable to make use of only one troop type and and see nothing wrong with using their troops to attack a state's weak points.
Not even considering all the underhanded things that go into either point of view and perspective, let's just look at the personality types at gravitate towards each point of view.
"Netters" have a tendency to be very astute at record keeping, efficiency projections, scheduling operations - and tend to lean towards a very elitist attitude to scorn people into accepting their way of play through projecting an image of power through net skills.
"Warmongers" have a tendency to be very good at organizing groups of people together for mass strikes, efficiently using turns to war and defend their nations - and tend to be overly aggressive and often will take rank positions as a "challenge".
Why will they never "get along"?
Well there is strong arguments for both points of view but the age old statements will always come out "you just can't net", "why don't you protect yourself?", and they will rub each other raw, as long as one projects an elitist attitude, and the other takes that as a challenge. Add to the mix the personality foibles of many, who will take E-things personally and begin to hate each other. It never ends.
For a few that seems to be their reason for playing - to find a nemesis and batter at each other each month.
Is this a bad thing? No, not really, as long as a level of respect comes into play....
And there is the rub. I have been away for awhile but it seems that the level of constant inability to respect still hangs fairly high. I don't see it changing.
Just saying. But don't mind me, I'm just a tourist.
::LD::GrimReapr
05-10-2012, 08:22
I'm not better than anyone in this game or in real life except criminals but I also look at it this way nobody is better than me either.
whats the point of this thread?
icn top 3 had the most spies/sams/ships at the start of the war. One wlf guy got more ships than me, but still less than margus and lenn. So you clearly didn't attack us for hoarding one unit. I thought you attacked us because I'm so annoying person, or because I threatened to declare war, solely to kill #836 like I said on my letter.
We have no problem with not hoarding. It's other nations who get complications. You see, it's harder to get NA for 4 units, rather than 1. Our nation is well organized (netting wise), and we can gather the NA. Other nations struggle and we benefit from it.
I have no problem getting along with you, although blade promised to attack you next set, I calmed him down and we will not attack you. As far as I am concerned we can fight through this set and be done. I will not carry any grudges over to next set. We aren't interested in making peace this set, you need to try and take our #1 and #2 down, as long as we have those spots, we will do our best to defend them.
If I seem elitist or look like I think I'm 'better than you' then I'm sorry, that hasn't been my intention... I play this game for fun... like everybody else, but fun for me is doing as best as I can. Avoid mistakes from last set and get a better networth in next set. I guess you define fun differently. Doesn't matter. Lets just play the game.
The point of this thread is merely to show the differences in perceptions and attitudes that cause the problems.
blaa you are showing example of one perception as LD did as well.
::LD::GrimReapr
05-10-2012, 09:38
whats the point of this thread?
icn top 3 had the most spies/sams/ships at the start of the war. One wlf guy got more ships than me, but still less than margus and lenn. So you clearly didn't attack us for hoarding one unit. I thought you attacked us because I'm so annoying person, or because I threatened to declare war, solely to kill #836 like I said on my letter.
We have no problem with not hoarding. It's other nations who get complications. You see, it's harder to get NA for 4 units, rather than 1. Our nation is well organized (netting wise), and we can gather the NA. Other nations struggle and we benefit from it.
I have no problem getting along with you, although blade promised to attack you next set, I calmed him down and we will not attack you. As far as I am concerned we can fight through this set and be done. I will not carry any grudges over to next set. We aren't interested in making peace this set, you need to try and take our #1 and #2 down, as long as we have those spots, we will do our best to defend them.
If I seem elitist or look like I think I'm 'better than you' then I'm sorry, that hasn't been my intention... I play this game for fun... like everybody else, but fun for me is doing as best as I can. Avoid mistakes from last set and get a better networth in next set. I guess you define fun differently. Doesn't matter. Lets just play the game.
I have no intention of carrying this over to next set as I stated in a different Thread. Our beef is the fact that ICN has stuck their nose in GRIM's business when it didn't belong there it's started out first set back when we AAed Kenny in January blade decided to open his mouth about it when what he didn't know was we were talkin to Kenny the whole time in private message and in game Messages about it we knew we would be warred for it we would have been stupid to think otherwise which what got ICN attacked the second set. Then the third set we had the gang bang coming I understand that but then the fourth set we wanna war Lor and again ICN pokes their nose where it isn't needed so in response we decided to give the nose a bit of a thwack. GRIM's purpose in this game is to stop infantry hoarding whether it be by war or by getting p to change how the units interact we don't are how. If you don't hoard infantry you won't have a problem with us. Now you can start the argument of what do we consider hoarding we all know everyone or anyone can have a balanced war ready state within a week is that what we are asking everyone to do no but we don't want to be seein people with 56 million inf and 5 k ships and 10 k agm because that is hoarding and will be dealt with how we deam necessary. Stocking is different just sitting there with 10k spies and 100k infantry with nothin else is understamdable they aren't the ones grabbing us with nothing but infantry all there doing for theist part is expanding building or grabbing each other but don't jump at the end o the set with nothing but ships and expect to have all of em before the set ends either cause that won't happen.
In conclusion again as stated above I have no intention of carrying this over to the next set. I feel we are even. We will go about our mission next set of netting peacefully Untill we find someone hoarding
Infantry.
Couple more thoughts, on Netters and Warmongers.
This set we have a "war" between two archtype Nations for Netter and Warmongers. ICN and GRIM/DEAD
Now the commentary:
ICN got into this war because of wounded pride. A few states appear to have taken great offense to situations and communication, and didn't do what you SHOULD do when you are watching the bottom line - walk away from it and out NET it. Being offended when someone makes a statement, and then trying to disprove it, so that in the end you do pull yourself into a situation where you can't prove things?
You lose.
Also it is very very bad to leave all the smaller newer members of your nation to fight wars your opinions and stances start. You had guys at the top still worried about their net position more then nation health. YES, it is very valid for the breakers to try to remain on top so that they themselves can't get broken, but seriously show some effort towards the war, you don't have to burn turns to finish but at least give the littler guys a hand. I know I wouldn't be back in a nation if they didn't commit from the top and I realized that the leaders helped create the war.
Bottom Line - protect it, don't draw fire, and by all matters adapt.
If the environment changes for you and people tell you they will attack unprotected states, then protect your states, and out net the states.
Margus was actually well covered and netting great. I don't think it was killing him.....
Don't give people a reason to target you, NET them down, and let that speak. Don't draw fire.
And whatever you do, leave wars dead at the end of a set.
GRIM/DEAD:
You had very nice turn out for strikes, but some of the prep for strikes wasn't there as well as it could be.
I know there is the fear of information leaks or whatever, and you guys have been doing this long enough that you can still kill tons of stuff without the prep that COULD be done.
But imagine if the guys had an idea what they needed to get to ahead of time? So that they might have only needed to use say 50 turns to adjust to the changes between target selection and strike?
Killing efficiency uses just as specialized states as Netters.
I saw it come out that way, but perhaps it's just you all know what each is going to do, or perhaps your enemies have been as soft as ICN for too long.
-- Huge kudos on the fact that i know you guys walk away from wars when they are done. And just want people to understand the simplest thing - don't go completely unprotected.
Wear a rubber when you net folks, it's a scary world out there!
I would be hugely pissed as a nation member and nation leader if my top two states did not help out.
Honestly, I'd HOBBLE them the next set, lol
Divine Intervention
05-15-2012, 17:33
I would be hugely pissed as a nation member and nation leader if my top two states did not help out.
tbf they are helping out with attacks. Would be a bit pointless having them waste all their 300 turns to kill states between the two of them when its much more effective to store
turns until they have like 5-7 restarts who could help out in a combined strike with them as breakers.
its gonna take alot of turns to take those two down.
bigstink
05-15-2012, 18:17
I'm not better than anyone in this game or in real life except criminals but I also look at it this way nobody is better than me either.
How about ex-criminals????
bigstink
05-15-2012, 18:21
whats the point of this thread?
icn top 3 had the most spies/sams/ships at the start of the war. One wlf guy got more ships than me, but still less than margus and lenn. So you clearly didn't attack us for hoarding one unit. I thought you attacked us because I'm so annoying person, or because I threatened to declare war, solely to kill #836 like I said on my letter.
We have no problem with not hoarding. It's other nations who get complications. You see, it's harder to get NA for 4 units, rather than 1. Our nation is well organized (netting wise), and we can gather the NA. Other nations struggle and we benefit from it.
I have no problem getting along with you, although blade promised to attack you next set, I calmed him down and we will not attack you. As far as I am concerned we can fight through this set and be done. I will not carry any grudges over to next set. We aren't interested in making peace this set, you need to try and take our #1 and #2 down, as long as we have those spots, we will do our best to defend them.
If I seem elitist or look like I think I'm 'better than you' then I'm sorry, that hasn't been my intention... I play this game for fun... like everybody else, but fun for me is doing as best as I can. Avoid mistakes from last set and get a better networth in next set. I guess you define fun differently. Doesn't matter. Lets just play the game.
+1
MellonColly
05-16-2012, 07:33
Stocking is different just sitting there with 10k spies and 100k infantry with nothin else is understamdable they aren't the ones grabbing us with nothing but infantry all there doing for theist part is expanding building or grabbing each other but don't jump at the end o the set with nothing but ships and expect to have all of em before the set ends either cause that won't happen.
pfff now you change your tune on stocking....Where was this when you hit UB when we were stocking farmers you ahole!
::LD::GrimReapr
05-16-2012, 09:41
pfff now you change your tune on stocking....Where was this when you hit UB when we were stocking farmers you ahole!
I didn't change my tune there is a difference between 100k infantry and 10k spies and 52million infantry 50k spies and nothing else which a few in UB had when we declared. I understand while stocking bank only holds so much and you start to buy units so as not to have money destroyed but if you can buy 50 mil infantry then you can buy some ships and agm so your not defenseless either.
ICN cheats by laundering their dirty money through the national tax system in order to artificially prop up the top 1-3 states.
Z
MellonColly
05-16-2012, 15:29
raise taxes on the top 1%!
(o shoot thats me...)
heyneken
05-16-2012, 18:47
ICN cheats by laundering their dirty money through the national tax system in order to artificially prop up the top 1-3 states.
Z
Isn't everyone from ICN except top1-2 dead? If you mean in general, then where's your proof? Imo ICN always starts with something like 25% tax-rate and follows quite a standard lowering scheme, and the nation army doesn't really matter that much, because we're always at top. At the moment it just seems you're talking bs, because you're plainly outnetted.
bigstink
05-16-2012, 22:03
here is a thought for you there old milwauke...
You have killed Bin(#261)
Your Bombers destroyed a total of 7 land.
During this attack, you lost 12 Bombers.
Your Nation lost 6 Bombers.
While defending, your enemy lost 383 SAMs.
::oops:
I have no intention of carrying this over to next set as I stated in a different Thread. Our beef is the fact that ICN has stuck their nose in GRIM's business when it didn't belong there it's started out first set back when we AAed Kenny in January blade decided to open his mouth about it when what he didn't know was we were talkin to Kenny the whole time in private message and in game Messages about it we knew we would be warred for it we would have been stupid to think otherwise which what got ICN attacked the second set. Then the third set we had the gang bang coming I understand that but then the fourth set we wanna war Lor and again ICN pokes their nose where it isn't needed so in response we decided to give the nose a bit of a thwack. GRIM's purpose in this game is to stop infantry hoarding whether it be by war or by getting p to change how the units interact we don't are how. If you don't hoard infantry you won't have a problem with us. Now you can start the argument of what do we consider hoarding we all know everyone or anyone can have a balanced war ready state within a week is that what we are asking everyone to do no but we don't want to be seein people with 56 million inf and 5 k ships and 10 k agm because that is hoarding and will be dealt with how we deam necessary. Stocking is different just sitting there with 10k spies and 100k infantry with nothin else is understamdable they aren't the ones grabbing us with nothing but infantry all there doing for theist part is expanding building or grabbing each other but don't jump at the end o the set with nothing but ships and expect to have all of em before the set ends either cause that won't happen.
In conclusion again as stated above I have no intention of carrying this over to the next set. I feel we are even. We will go about our mission next set of netting peacefully Untill we find someone hoarding
Infantry.
My personal opinion, this is none of your business nor is it in your authority to come in here demanding a **** thing from the community or anyone else and expect to have an easy time of it. Not better than anyone else? Why do you think your intellect is such that you know what is best for he game and community.
Come on, try speaking out of one side of your mouth for a change.
heyneken
05-17-2012, 05:43
here is a thought for you there old milwauke...
You have killed Bin(#261)
Your Bombers destroyed a total of 7 land.
During this attack, you lost 12 Bombers.
Your Nation lost 6 Bombers.
While defending, your enemy lost 383 SAMs.
::oops:
Your point being? I've always said it's extremely easy to take down top states - you just let everybody hoard a unit, collect some turns and set a date. It's virtually impossible to have 4 units so that no one breaks you.
My personal opinion, this is none of your business nor is it in your authority to come in here demanding a **** thing from the community or anyone else and expect to have an easy time of it. Not better than anyone else? Why do you think your intellect is such that you know what is best for he game and community.
Come on, try speaking out of one side of your mouth for a change.
I fail to see where there are any demands in the post! If you are referring to whats highlighted in red again I see no demands I see a statement. I also fail to see where he is claiming to be better than someone as well. what does his intellect have to do with it? Does Mr.P not ask for suggestions to make the game better? How about you stop speaking out your arse. Where is this any of your business more so than it is his for the same reasons arent we all here to play a game and help it get better?
DevilDog
05-17-2012, 19:50
@ Beamer - It's called fishing. Sometimes when you don't have it you have to look for it anywhere you can. ;)
My personal opinion, this is none of your business nor is it in your authority to come in here demanding a **** thing from the community or anyone else and expect to have an easy time of it. Not better than anyone else? Why do you think your intellect is such that you know what is best for he game and community.
Come on, try speaking out of one side of your mouth for a change.
I agree with you on this BUT isnt it great that the community is trying to self-police things that they see as a problem with the game. How can anyone deny that true hoarding is actually a good thing, and at least a group of people have banded together to make a change. I applaud that over and over. There has been many time though out the history of the game both WOW and NW that some community policing was needed and didnt occur.
I am not part of this movement as I have a different mission (training new players) but I am very happy to see such a movement in the game even if everyone does not agree with the exact particulars.
You have to admit and give credit for at least that part of it even if you dont agree with the specifics.
I fail to see where there are any demands in the post! If you are referring to whats highlighted in red again I see no demands I see a statement. I also fail to see where he is claiming to be better than someone as well. what does his intellect have to do with it? Does Mr.P not ask for suggestions to make the game better? How about you stop speaking out your arse. Where is this any of your business more so than it is his for the same reasons arent we all here to play a game and help it get better?
Better for who? Those that just want it to be all out war? Or better for those that like to play it as it was originally meant to be played? With diplomacy, teamwork and strategy trying to make the best state they can and achieve a set win. What is the winner of the game and how is it determined, who kills the most or who nets the highest? Just saying.
::LD::GrimReapr
05-18-2012, 18:24
who has the highest net at the ned wins but if us hoarding infantry killers kill the hoarders then who wins thats right we who do not hoard. stick that pickle on a burger and eat it.
Sorry thought that was funny.
its not about all out warring from what I see the anti hoarders saying. I interpret it a dont inf hoard because it allows inf hoarders to out net balanced states and use them as land farms.
::LD::GrimReapr
05-19-2012, 10:58
GRIM/DEAD:
You had very nice turn out for strikes, but some of the prep for strikes wasn't there as well as it could be.
I know there is the fear of information leaks or whatever, and you guys have been doing this long enough that you can still kill tons of stuff without the prep that COULD be done.
But imagine if the guys had an idea what they needed to get to ahead of time? So that they might have only needed to use say 50 turns to adjust to the changes between target selection and strike?
Killing efficiency uses just as specialized states as Netters.
I saw it come out that way, but perhaps it's just you all know what each is going to do, or perhaps your enemies have been as soft as ICN for too long.
-- Huge kudos on the fact that i know you guys walk away from wars when they are done. And just want people to understand the simplest thing - don't go completely unprotected.
Wear a rubber when you net folks, it's a scary world out there!
Yes, We could be a bit more informative with that which you have pointed out. I take full responsibility as the nation leader on those failings and my problem there is almost everyone in my nation I know personally and talk to daily at work which is why we know which is needed almost all the time. I apologize to those in my nation that were left out of the loop on units needed and such in a timely manner. Some of that was the fact I didn't know but that in no ways gets me off the hook for the stuff you pointed out. I thank you for the constructive criticism and will strive to make myself better.
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