Iraq

[ranger2112]

i have eye-strain from reading the last couple of post, however I did get through them. i for one agreed with the initial invasion and the overthrow of Saddam and I think that leaving now will lead to another "bay of pigs" issue. Kennedy set our foreign relations back 30 years when he bailed and nearly extinguished every living thing on this planet. we cannot do the same in Iraq. as distasteful as it is we need to stay there until the present FREELY ELECTED government has a better handle on the situation. i believe we WILL be involved with other countries in our "little sandbox" and continue to fight terrorism...problem is, as earlier stated, there is no winning. we either continue to fight them and get with with car bombs etc or we leave them alone and allow them to regroup and get a VERY BIG CAR BOMB either way is is gonna be a messy next several years that will require us, the USA, the strongest nation around to merely stem the tide of big terrorism and constantly fight the little wars that will always keep us in a bad eye with many nations. thats because these nations rather keep th eir blinders on and simply hope the problem will go away.\

so there, this is my book...

[Hoebawt]

Holy crap.. and you all complain about my speeches

First @ hoe, If you think for one min that the US govt or any other major Govt cares that the middle east is the "holy" land then you are mistaken. All we see is the oil we need and an unbalanced country controlling it. I do agree that the whole region over there has always been at war and always will, cause THEY are the ones who care about the holy land.

Mwahahaha:

I actually agree with what you said.

The main thing is we all try to speculate why the US invaded Iraq. We really do not know why. The only one who knows this for sure is GW Bush and Co. There are so many deals that are made that the normal citizen has no clue about.

I for one don't agree that we need to set up Democracy in every country. Why do we have to have everyone doing what we do? The reason is cause if we set them up with a Democracy then we can control MORE of what they do. Like Mwahaha said, we actually had a nice goodwill presence in that region, but now we don't. Yes someone needs to stand up and stop the terrorists, but dang let's go to where the terrorists really are, and let's get the ones who really hit us.

In Desert Storm Saddam was totally humiliated. There was so much talk about how big and strong his army was that everyone thought we were getting into another war like vietnam. Little did he know his men would throw up there hands at the first sign of US Troops. He lost more than the war during that time. But why on earth would he even try that again? He knows that if he attacked the US that he would lose. Don't get me wrong, i'm glad he is gone, but he was not the #1 priority.

I don't even here anything about Bin Laden on the news anymore, unless of course he sends another letter making his threats. Then it's pumped into our minds so we can be scared. I'm sorry, but i don't believe for one second that we can't find him. We have satalite's that can tell what color my crap is, so i don't buy that we can't find him. I think we don't want to find him. Cause once we do then 99.9999% of the Americans will want us out of Iraq right now! But if Bin Laden is still on the run and free then we have justification in staying in Iraq.

Oil to me is the only logical explination as to why we are in Iraq. We needed and wanted to get more control over this oil supply. Could you imagine what would happen if Iraq cut off oil suppies to the US? But now that we have set up there Govt and helped them in setting up a democracy, well now we have our hands deeper in there pockets and are able to "control" them easier.

I see good points and bad points to this war.

Mr P America Owns the Most Oil Rich land in the world... Alaska..... If Iraq and all of them countries would Boycott us and cutt us off from their oil, within years we will have more Barrels then them from our own supply... we can even unbalance the market if we wished..... its def not just over oil.... GWB is their cleaning up his fathers mess.... We should have never entered Iraq.. we had no reason... and now the Country is in debt and we are mking alot of enemies... Personally I think Osma is ither already Dead or in our hands... and telling the ppl hes captured would only put pressure on our Gov to pull out of afganstan and iraq..... Fear is a great tool... YOu can Control the masses if you can inflict them wit a fear...and thats what our gov is doing... They gave us a fear that we can be attacked on our homeland and now lil by lil they have stripped our Rights..... Since bush as became president the check and balance system has changed... Power has gone into the Excutive branch more now then any other president ever

What we need to do is give Iraq over to the Arab countries and let them try to fix our mess.... its not likes its even their duty but those countries hate us coz of how we a western Power is influencing a new gov in the region.. in the long run it will only mk things worse.... Iraq is a messed up place that we wont be able to fix at all

[Mr President]

Mr P America Owns the Most Oil Rich land in the world... Alaska..... If Iraq and all of them countries would Boycott us and cutt us off from their oil, within years we will have more Barrels then them from our own supply... we can even unbalance the market if we wished..... its def not just over oil.... GWB is their cleaning up his fathers mess.... We should have never entered Iraq.. we had no reason... and now the Country is in debt and we are mking alot of enemies... Personally I think Osma is ither already Dead or in our hands... and telling the ppl hes captured would only put pressure on our Gov to pull out of afganstan and iraq..... Fear is a great tool... YOu can Control the masses if you can inflict them wit a fear...and thats what our gov is doing... They gave us a fear that we can be attacked on our homeland and now lil by lil they have stripped our Rights..... Since bush as became president the check and balance system has changed... Power has gone into the Excutive branch more now then any other president ever

What we need to do is give Iraq over to the Arab countries and let them try to fix our mess.... its not likes its even their duty but those countries hate us coz of how we a western Power is influencing a new gov in the region.. in the long run it will only mk things worse.... Iraq is a messed up place that we wont be able to fix at all

Of course we would tap into Alaska if needed.. But we will do all we can to use up other nations oil long before we tap into our own supply.. And of course conservationist will have a field day if we tried to tap into alaska.

I also agree that we are in Iraq to clean up "daddy's" mess. But i don't think
it's the whole reason.

we are not making anymore enemies that we didn't already have. You think they hate us cause we hit Iraq? They have always hated us. They are just using Iraq as the latest reason to voice why they hate us.

I also agree with you about the fear thing. As long as Americans are scared then we will keep empowering the govt. This is my biggest complaint, as i'm sure you all have read many many times. The Govt is taking more and more away from us each day. And we are doing NOTHING to stop them. The only thing this country cares about is money and health care. Pride for your family and pride in doing a good days work is gone. If someone doesn't make 1 million dollars a year then the govt sucks.. The baby boomers are the main problem. This is where it all really started. I only hope you, the younger generation gets more involved and works hard to make things right.

I don't think we need to give Iraq to anyone but IRAQ! Who are we to hand over a country or to control a country? Iraq belongs to Iraq... period!

I think we agree on many things Hoe. But there are some things we don't. I'm not saying i am right, or you are wrong.. But this is why the parties were created. To debate the differences and merge ideas to make the best possible solution. This doesn't happen anymore. it's whoever controls the house. Rarely do you ever see republicans vote for a democratic policy. And the same the other way around. Things need to change. power needs to get back in the hands of the people. Approval ratings are just a news topic now. Use to be that if your approval rating was in the crapper you worked harder and started listening to things.. Not anymore. :-(

[Hoebawt]

We Dont live in a democracy we live in a two party dictatorship

[Mr President]

.. Sadly i agree with that comment..

[Hoebawt]

Its very sad but yet very true

[Shabaz K]

Hmmm idk Sean i think we are donig worse then saddam.... yea he was ****ed up for killin his own ppl and constantly killin the Kurds... but Saddam was also the only one who united the Sunnies and Shiites somethign that prob wont happen for a very long time if it ever does..... like i said in another post we really unbalanaced the region.....


And for the reasons we went into IRAQ are reasons for war... wtf are we waiting for to go into Iran and other Countries in that region


and Mr P you are wrong about everyone caring about Oil in the Mid east.... thats holy land... the wars have been giong on there for 1000s of years... and oil has only be around for wat 100 or so years....

The Middle East will always be on the spotlight since thats the Holy Land for about 80% of the world..... Wars are always gonna happen there and wont stop ever... not till one of the sides gets strong enough and set out on mission of Ethnic Cleansing and Genocide........ not saying i agree wit that but thats the only way peace will ever come to the Mid east

actually saddam never could unite the shias and sunnies plainly becuase he took the power away form shias. saddam pretty much teated them bad aswell. sadly the United States made it even more impossible for us to unite.
but when the 2 sides do untie thats when USA has to look for other alliance and just get out of middle east but like i said wont happen in the near future cuase the sunnies are treating them bad look at Qatar shias arent even allowed to ahve top jobs, same in other countries around Saudia Arabia

[ranger2112]

We Dont live in a democracy we live in a two party dictatorship

actually we live in a Republic...in a Republic the majority rules in a democracy every single voice counts.


Rome was a Republic and it fell under its own weight and corruption....our Republic has become bloated and cumbersome and I am sad to say will not live forever...

[ranger2112]

Of course we would tap into Alaska if needed.. But we will do all we can to use up other nations oil long before we tap into our own supply.. And of course conservationist will have a field day if we tried to tap into alaska.

I also agree that we are in Iraq to clean up "daddy's" mess. But i don't think
it's the whole reason.

we are not making anymore enemies that we didn't already have. You think they hate us cause we hit Iraq? They have always hated us. They are just using Iraq as the latest reason to voice why they hate us.

I also agree with you about the fear thing. As long as Americans are scared then we will keep empowering the govt. This is my biggest complaint, as i'm sure you all have read many many times. The Govt is taking more and more away from us each day. And we are doing NOTHING to stop them. The only thing this country cares about is money and health care. Pride for your family and pride in doing a good days work is gone. If someone doesn't make 1 million dollars a year then the govt sucks.. The baby boomers are the main problem. This is where it all really started. I only hope you, the younger generation gets more involved and works hard to make things right.

I don't think we need to give Iraq to anyone but IRAQ! Who are we to hand over a country or to control a country? Iraq belongs to Iraq... period!

I think we agree on many things Hoe. But there are some things we don't. I'm not saying i am right, or you are wrong.. But this is why the parties were created. To debate the differences and merge ideas to make the best possible solution. This doesn't happen anymore. it's whoever controls the house. Rarely do you ever see republicans vote for a democratic policy. And the same the other way around. Things need to change. power needs to get back in the hands of the people. Approval ratings are just a news topic now. Use to be that if your approval rating was in the crapper you worked harder and started listening to things.. Not anymore. :-(

WHile i cannot entirely condone what our current administration has done...some things lately seem familiar....something i seen in black and white several years ago and they all spoke German....however had the CLINTON administration NOT let Osama off the hook whenever they had him in their sights things would have been different...had our government NOT trainied and funded the Taliban in the first place so that they could continue to keep Russia's attention things would have been different...had Kennedy NOT abandoned Cuba at the Bay of Pigs and started the cold war...things would have been different....

BUT THOSE THINGS DID HAPPEN....and now our generation has to pay...lets hope our kids dont pay an even heavier price.....

[Hoebawt]

You ever think of wat would have happened if Clinton Did stop Osma.... Im sure 9 11 wouldnt have been the worst attack on America.... im also sure we would lost any support we have in the middle east